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5th edition rules
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Steve
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 6:48 am Post subject: 5th edition rules Reply with quote

The following is a quote from Warseer. It tries to summarize the rules differences between the leaked 5th edition beta rules and the current ones. SO, for all those interested here they are.

Quote:

Hi, this is a complete summary of all the rules changes I have found using the leaked PDF. All these rules are still up for change remember so come August/September they might not make it into the final edition. Please appreciate that i have not posted the exact wording of the rules in order to match the forum guidelines and Brimstone has said it is okay to post the thread in this manner

Any unresolved questions feel free to PM me

I personally love the new missions, combat resolution modifiers (my poor Tau) and the Deep Strike Mishap chart

The rules which I think are most interesting are further down the list (missions, deep strike mishap, assault combat resolution)

• Running – instead of shooting can opt to run d6” (cannot assault) (note Fleet of Foots advantage now is that you can assault)
• Cover rules (a cover save is needed when shooting into cover, for the unit being shot at when you are shooting out of more than 2” of cover, shooting through cover to enemy on the other side)
• Shooting – if you shoot through friendly units on the same level as you the enemy unit being fired at gains a 4+ cover save
• Templates – Now all templates auto hit all the models underneath e.g. a ball of flame from an explosion
• Pinning/Go To Ground – after the enemy has rolled to hit or wound you can declare your models pinned and the unit cannot do anything that turn. They will benefit from +1 to their cover save or a 6+ save if not in cover
• Pinning – If forced to pin you take a -1 modifier Ld test if below half strength
• Blast weapons – all weapons with a blast, instead of rolling to hit automatically hit the target area chosen but scatter 2D6"
• (Flame) Template weapons – you don’t need to roll to hit
• Twin-linked template weapons – re-roll to wound
• Moving through units – troops cannot move through friendly units unless there enough room for its base or hull to fit through
• Rending – cause an AP2 wound against non-vehicles and against vehicles adds D3 to the Armour Penetration
• Sniper (cant remember old rules so may not be diff) – always a 4+ to wound, pinning, rending, 2D AP against vehicles (no bonus for rending)
• Pile-In moves are now at a 6” maximum and if this means you cannot reach unit coherency you will have to use part of your next movement phase to become coherent before moving again
• Assault – can assault multiple units as long as you can maintain coherency, must declare which is the primary target and move to engage that unit first (must start assault against the unit it shot at) must attack the first unit if in its 2” assault range, if engaged with more than one enemy at the beginning of the fight you can choose where to assign the attacks
• If assaulting enemy units into/out of/through cover and you had to taking a Difficult Terrain test your Initiative is reduced to 1 (if the enemy unit were locked in combat in the last turn this does not apply)
• Consolidation moves at end of assault can only be used to enter already locked combats and not start them
• Pistols are the only shooting weapon that confers +1 attack in combats
• Powerfists – if using a powerfist only secondary powerfists/thunder hammers will confer a +1 attack bonus. If using another special weapon eg. a power weapon powerfists may count towards the +1 attack bonus
• Morale checks (cant remember if diff) – now take a test if unit falling back pass through or touches normal unit
• Morale checks - -1 extra modifier to any other Ld test modifiers if below half strength
• Morale checks – If you lose an assault you gain a -1 modifier for every wound caused – my poor tau 
• If you are immune to psychology somehow when losing a combat you take as many wounds as you are outnumbered by e.g. outnumbered 2:1 equals 2 wounds (walkers + mc’s = 10 models)
• Falling Back – fleeing troops may not Go To Ground (pinning rule) or automatically pass pinning tests
• Falling Back units may shoot while moving or opt to run (moving towards closest table edge). You cannot assault when falling back
• Falling back troops automatically pass all morale checks except to regroup
• Regroup – can regroup falling units with a Ld test if further than 6” from nearest enemy unit and above half strength
• Regroup - +1 to roll needed if no enemy is visible or in area terrain
• Regroup – if regrouped can Assault and Run or Shoot (count as moving)
• Independent Characters – Move Through Cover and Skilled Rider rules
• Independent Characters – In combat must be in B2B and can be targeted separately
• MCs – Shoot at 1 target, cannot voluntarily pin
• (Dark) Eldar Jet bikes – May make an extra 6” movement in the Assault phase instead of assaulting
• Artillery – artillery units may not run, and may not assault if there is a gun
• Artillery – models hit on 1-4 and guns hit on a 5-6 (like in fantasy), guns are AV10 and will automatically be destroyed on a glancing or penetrating hit
• Artillery – automatically fail sweeping advance tests
• Roads – vehicle except walkers and skimmers may move at double speed if they use their full movement distance along a road
• Vehicles – if moving 6” or less (Combat speed) may fire one single weapon. If moving at 6-12” (Cruising speed) or more cannot shoot
• Defensive Weapons – Any weapon that is Strength 4 or less (defensive) may be fired when moving at Combat Speed and in addition to their main weapon
• Defensive Weapons – may not be fired if you’re using an Ordnance weapon that turn
• Ordnance Barrage – must be stationary to fire, no defensive weapons may be fired, pinning tests incur for wounded models
• New singular Damage Tables –
1.Crew Shaken (no shooting),
2.Crew Stunned (no movement or shooting
3. Damaged – 1 Weapon Destroyed, if none left Immobilised
4. Damaged – Immobilised, if already move to Wrecked
5. Damaged – Wrecked. Destroyed and becomes wreckage
6. Damaged – Explodes. 6” in all directions S3 Ap-. Vehicles not affected and ground becomes Difficult Terrain
• Modifiers:
Glancing hit -2
Hit by ‘AP–‘ weapon -1
Hit by ‘AP1’ weapon +1
Target is Open-topped +1
• Hull Down/Obscured – 50% of vehicle must be in terrain to be hull down
• Obscured units may take the appropriate cover save for the terrain if they get a Glancing/Penetrating hit. If obscured from wargear the save is always 5+
• Vehicles are not hull down if in open Area Terrain
• Shooting at Vehicles – if you cannot see 100% of one side the vehicle gains a 3+ cover save
• Assaulting Vehicles - you assaault the armour side that the majority of your unit are facing
• Vehicle Assaults – Troops Strength +D6 Armour Penetration
• Defensive Grenades (i.e. Photon Grenades) – 4+D6 AP vs. vehicles
• Defensive Granades - When charged by enemy units the grenades cause them to lose their +1 attack for charging
• Assault Grenades (i.e. Frag Grenades) – 5+D6 AP vs. Vehicles
• Assault Grenades - if assault enemy units in terrain the combat will be fough on initiative basis
• Krak Grenades – 6+D6 AP vs. Vehicles
• Melta Bombs – 8+2D6 AP vs. Vehicles
• Vehicle Squadrons – Immobilised vehicles may be abandoned and in the process are destroyed and wrecked
• Vehicle Squadrons –shoot at one unit per turn. If shot at hits distributed evenly
• Vehicle Squadrons – if assaulted count as separate vehicles
• Transport Fire Points – cannot shoot if at Cruising Speed, counts as moving
• Transport Embarking – all of the models within 2” of Access Point or no embarking allowed
• Transport Disembarking – may shoot but not assault (no mention of Running)
• Effects of Transport Damage on Passengers – Wrecked causes a Pinning Test and Explosion causes a S4 AP- hit and a pinning test
• Ramming Tanks – If ramming cannot shoot. To ram a tank you move in the same way as a Tank Shock. Causes damage to both tanks on the correct side. +1S for every armour point above 10 and +1 for every 3” moved +1, tank +1
• Open Topped Vehicles - +1 to result of vehicle damage
• Fast Vehicles – May choose to make a Flat Out move granting them 18” to move but cannot shoot
• Fast Vehicles Firing – At Combat Speed may move and shoot all weapons like a stationary vehicle e.g. ordnance weapons. At Cruising Speed may move and fire like normal vehicles’ combat speed
• Flat Out – cannot embark/disembark troops
• Skimmers – cannot end move over friendly/enemy troops
• Skimmers – if moving at Cruising or Flat Out speed count as obscured
• Skimmers – if at Cruising Speed or Flat Out and is immobilised it’s destroyed, if it at Combat Speed immobilised as normal and no longer a skimmer
• Skimmers – need a 6 to hit skimmers in combat
• Walkers – may Run
• Walkers – If stationary may fire all weapons, if at combat speed may fire one
• Walkers – If immobilised or Stunned in combat, loses one attack
• Walkers – May Death or Glory ramming moves
• Universal Special Rule – Eternal Warrior – immune to instant death
• Feel No Pain – cannot be used if you won’t receive an armour save
• Fleet – can Run and Assault
• Slow and Purposeful - Units with SaP have the Relentless special rule and count as moving through difficult terrain when moving
• Relentless - a unit may move, fire weapons as though they are stationary and then assault in the same turn
• Stealth – units receive a +1 to cover saves
• Stubborn – receive no Ld modifiers for morale checks
• Turbo Boosters – Jet Bikes and Bikes may move up to 20”, if moves more than 18” the model receives a 3+ save
• Standard Missions-
1-2 Recon
3-4 Take & Hold
5-6 Total Annihilation
• Standard Missions - all standard mission have the rules Reserves, Deep Strike, Random Game Length (All these missions have been changed)
• Recon – D3+2 markers. Control objective if you are within 3” and there are no enemies within 3”. Player with the most objectives wins
• Take & Hold – Player places an objective in each Deployment Zone, each objective is claimed if within 3” and no enemy units. Player with most wins
• Total Annihilation – Player with highest number of kill points wins. HQ=3 kill points. Heavy Elite Fast Attacks=2 Kill Points. Troops = 1 Kill Point
• Scoring Units – Troops are the only scoring units. Troops that are vehicles or falling back are not scoring units
• Deployment – Roll off for deployment type.
• 1-2 Spearhead (Table Quarters)
• 3-4 Pitched Battle (long edge)
• 5-6 Dawn of War (long edge) place 1HQ and 2Troop on the table and on your first turn models not already deployed can move on from the table edge, infiltrators may start as normal
• Deep Strike – if a unit deep strikes onto a unit/terrain/off the board you roll on the deep strike mishap table. 1=Destroyed, 2/3=unit removed counts as half strength for VP, 4/6= Opponent may place unit anywhere without scattering
• Random Game Length – if at end of turn 5 the player who just had their turn roll a d6 on a 3+ you play turn 6. At end of turn 6 roll a 4+ and turn 7 is played
• Reserves – on turn 5 or later units arrive automatically
• Outflanking Reserves – scouts/infiltrators may try to Outflank, on a d6 roll of 1-2 the unit enters play via left short edge, 3-4 enter via right short edge, 5-6 choose
• Reserves – Scouts/Infiltrators may flank in dedicated transports
• Victory Points – gain 50% of unit worth if unit is below half strength
• If BS is 6 or great you get a re-roll to hit if you miss (doesn’t Get Hot) e.g. BS6 need a 2 to hit and a 6 if you miss. BS7 2/5, BS8 2/4, BS9 2/3, BS10 2/2 (if you have a master-crafted weapon you get the same chance to hit as on your first shot)

Aurellis.


Steve
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Lord_of_End_Times
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 10:32 am Post subject: Reply with quote

Did not know you liked 40k steve. One Love
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Ir0nSide
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 7:16 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

People like 40k?
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Lord_of_End_Times
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 9:11 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess. One Love
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Steve
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 10:33 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Lord_of_End_Times wrote:
Did not know you liked 40k steve.


40K was the first thing I noticed when I first walked into the Geek.

I'm very drawn to Scifi type models and game play. BUT I value good game play over eyecandy.

When I heard GW was going to revamp the 40K rules, I did some checking. Honestly though, I've never played 40k and therefor don't have a real understanding for a good comparison.
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full_blooded_ork
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 5:57 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

If you ever wanted to learn I can teach you 40k.

It's not as involved as fantasy, but because of that it's not as tatical and thus many prefer fantasy.
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KidCthulhu
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 7:55 pm Post subject: Dark Millenium Reply with quote

Oh, back in the day Warhammer 40K was just as complex and interesting and full of strategy as Fantasy is today.

But then 3rd Edition came out, and the "assault" phase was added. Then things went downhill from there. Things got majorly dumbed down. Fluff was removed from the rulebooks & codicies (yes, that is the correct plural of codex) to keep costs down and more & more plastic Marine kits came out. And the reason? So a younger crowd could afford the hobby and understand it.

I would prefer 40K to mirror Fantasy, as it used to. There were some great advances in Fantasy that could apply. Close combat is a good example. My Necromunda players can back me up this one, as that game uses 2nd Ed 40K combat rules.

But alas, it is what is.
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Lord_of_End_Times
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 8:03 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Hell yeah Nercomunda is great. Gang fighting in the underhive. One Love
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Burrfoot812
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 8:21 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Wait for Mordheim...Thats a fun game too. Just like Nercomunda.
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Lord_of_End_Times
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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah man it is. I got my Middenhelmers. One Love
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full_blooded_ork
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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 4:04 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I would prefer 40K to mirror Fantasy, as it used to. There were some great advances in Fantasy that could apply. Close combat is a good example.


Fantasy uses a different CC system then Necromunda though.
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Lord_of_End_Times
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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 6:50 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Well in ways it is. But the whole charging thing is what I think he is highlighting. One Love
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KidCthulhu
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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2008 11:43 am Post subject: What I was -trying- to say Reply with quote

Well, what I meant is that there were some very good things about Fantasy that could have worked its way into 40K and improved it if both systems still mirrored each other.

I used close combat as an example of how something in Fantasy was used to update the old 40K. Fantasy had that great comparison of WS to WS to determine what you have to roll to hit, while at the time, 40K had that very cumbersome bit of adding your WS to a handfull of dice and then seeing whose total was higher.

But yes, at least in the day, you either shot a unit or your charged it for close combat. Not "Well, we'll move 6 inches, shoot, then move another 6 inches and attack the survivors if there are any. Oh, no survivors but there's a fresh unit within "assault range"? Too bad, we have to sit here then."

There was so much potential that could have been slightly tweaked in 40K by using the strides that Fantasy made.

Example, the "psychic phase" that 40K used to have. It had force cards, nullify cards, ultimate force cards, and daemonic attack cards that were very similar to how magic in Fantasy was done. It could have been streamlined with dice like the Magic phase in Fantasy. Psychic characters used to be one of the big things in 40K. If not for the Emperor being the most psychic being on Terra, the humans never would have had a unified Earth, formed the Space Marines, and stopped the Waagh!. But from what I last saw, psykers in 40K are about as useful as rubber chainswords.

But it seems players would rather have more Marines with AP <whatever> weapons instead of save modifiers and things like that, than a lot of the atmosphere, complexity, and drama that was once 40K.

That being said, I'm logging off to work on my Fantasy army.
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full_blooded_ork
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 1:06 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Psychers aren't entirely useless in 40k, they just aren't required. I do agree withyou there though, I'd love for 40k to have a magic phase.
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Rocco Terranova
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PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:39 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Bashing 40k in its own Forum. Ouch thats got to hurt it's pride. Anyway i don't know much about rules before 4th edition. But i like the 5th editions rules. If i was a little less ignorant to the other rules i would say at least 40k is trying to separate themselves from Fantasy.
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